|
Post by MarkAnderson on Dec 17, 2016 9:08:09 GMT -7
Or perhaps you got stronger during your Strength Phase, but the friction on your pads got worse, so it didn't register on paper.
I sand religiously all through my strength phase. I do wonder if my pads get a bit too slick for optimal hangboarding as a result of this, but who cares? I'm not trying to optimize my hangboard performance, I'm trying to optimize my rock climbing performance. If I don't sand during my Strength Phase my skin won't be ready when it comes time to climb outside.
|
|
|
Post by Chris W on Dec 17, 2016 20:29:56 GMT -7
Or perhaps you got stronger during your Strength Phase, but the friction on your pads got worse, so it didn't register on paper. Didn't think of that. Typically, I don't have a lot of skin issues. I think it's likely because my opportunities to climb outdoors are mostly limited to 6 weeks in the fall and 6 weeks in the spring. My chance to hit the skin-eating boulders at Governor Stable got cancelled today, thanks to freezing rain
|
|
rowan
New Member
Posts: 1
|
Post by rowan on Dec 18, 2016 17:55:31 GMT -7
I've been doing some reading and preparing to try this out and have a couple of questions. How deep is the water in relation to your hand while you are doing this? And are people using the one or two hand method?
|
|
|
Post by tetrault on Dec 18, 2016 18:26:17 GMT -7
I have yet to spend the time researching to see if it is completely safe to send 18-24v across your chest (and heart) on a somewhat regular basis, so I have been using the 1 hand method. The negative terminal is at the tips of my fingers. I am actually doing a modified "1 hand method" that is really just treating the finger tips. I can't say that it has worked wonders at this point. I am considering incorporating the polarity swap as per the "standard" hyperhidrosis treatment at some point. **edit: The tables in these 2 sources appear to disagree with slides #42-43 of the slideshow link ( link) that was included in the Anderson Iontophoresis II blog post, and suggest that the positively charged electrode will produce hardened skin. Google book 1
Google book 2
No idea which is correct, but after getting a flapper on my first pad yesterday, I plan on trying the opposite polarity for a while. Maybe the "improvent" I thought I was seeing was more related to the seasons changing as I was experimenting as the weather was cooling and drying, or maybe just plain "placebo effect".
|
|
|
Post by aikibujin on Feb 14, 2017 9:51:55 GMT -7
No idea which is correct, but after getting a flapper on my first pad yesterday, I plan on trying the opposite polarity for a while. Maybe the "improvent" I thought I was seeing was more related to the seasons changing as I was experimenting as the weather was cooling and drying, or maybe just plain "placebo effect". Any updates on your experiment? As the weather warms up in CO (it was 80 last Friday!), I'm starting to dread the days when I leave a puddle of sweat everywhere and grease off the biggest jugs. I'm seriously considering trying Iontophoresis. I'm unfortunate enough to be really sweaty and have dry skin at the same time (as evidenced by the many bloody cracks I have on the back of my hands at the moment). So I'm hoping to find a solution that will stop my hands from sweating too much, without drying out my skin.
|
|
|
Post by aikibujin on Feb 14, 2017 15:14:27 GMT -7
**edit: The tables in these 2 sources appear to disagree with slides #42-43 of the slideshow link ( link) that was included in the Anderson Iontophoresis II blog post, and suggest that the positively charged electrode will produce hardened skin. Google book 1
Google book 2
You're right, two other slides from the same site also agrees with the books. Slide one, #13. Positive electrode harden tissues. Slide two, #13. Positive electrode harden tissues. So it must be a typo in that first slide you referenced.
|
|
|
Post by tetrault on Feb 15, 2017 4:13:26 GMT -7
Sorry, no update. I put the Iontophoresis experiment on hold. I was instead looking for a root cause to the trouble I have with my middle finger tips. I think this is in part from the thin crimp on the Hangboard, which I now swapped out for a wooden grip. Not wanting too many variables, I am just sanding through this HB phase.
Thanks for posting more info! Interesting that it seems to be the positive electrode producing the hardening. However, if you are looking to reduce sweating, it seems (from limited reading on the internet) that the polarity swap midway is key, thus, which polarity produces hardening is not important.
|
|
|
Post by MarkAnderson on Feb 15, 2017 13:05:21 GMT -7
Interesting. If switching polarity is the key, Alternating Current would be the best way to do 1-tin ITP. I'll try 1-tin again with (DC) reversed polarity when summer rolls around.
|
|
|
Post by aikibujin on Feb 16, 2017 6:49:03 GMT -7
Since I'm not doing much climbing these days, I'm going to donate myself to science. The material I ordered for the homemade iontophoresis setup will arrive next week, I plan to treat my left hand only (so I can surf the forum with my right hand!), I'm going to experiment with the polarity swap and report back in a few weeks.
|
|
|
Post by aikibujin on Mar 2, 2017 22:13:25 GMT -7
I hope I'm not getting my hopes up too prematurely, but after less than 2 weeks of iontophoresis, I have noticed some improvements today. It was in the 50s in Denver. As I was driving home from work and holding the steering wheel with both hands, I noticed my left hand (the one I'm experimenting on) was less clammy than my right. Then after my kids went to sleep tonight, I did a hangboard workout and put liquid chalk on both hands at the beginning of my workout. Ten minutes into the workout, my right hand had visibly less chalk than my left, and it felt slightly clammier. Of course this can be entirely coincidental, maybe I'm just gripping harder with my right hand. So the real test will come on Saturday when I go climbing outside in 60-degree sunny weather at a south facing crag. I will report back afterwards!
|
|
|
Post by tetrault on Mar 3, 2017 17:25:21 GMT -7
What are the specs on your setup? Voltage? Anything added to the water (ex: salt)? Polarity and/or are you swapping polarity mid-treatment session? Time per session? Sessions per week?
Also - probably too early to say, but does your treated hand seem to be any more prone to splitting from the lack of sweat?
Thanks!
|
|
|
Post by aikibujin on Mar 3, 2017 19:36:33 GMT -7
What are the specs on your setup? All in good time, my friend! Let me just make sure it's not some placebo effect first. I should have more data by more tomorrow night!
|
|
|
Post by aikibujin on Mar 4, 2017 20:27:02 GMT -7
So the result I'm noticing is totally legit. Today was a very dry day, so it was not the worst day in terms of sweat factor, but there is a very noticeable difference between my left hand (treated) and right hand (un-treated). It was especially noticeable when I was driving home from the crag, I'm usually still thinking about the climbs I did, so my hands used to sweat on the drive home. But today, my left hand was definitely drier than my right hand. Here's a photo of my hands after I've been belaying using a pair of full finger belay gloves. My dog totally photo bombed this... Photo: Mark Anderson So my set up is pretty much exactly Mark's one hand method: disposable aluminum bake pan, 2 plastic lids at the bottom of the pan, 2 6-V lantern batteries, 3 alligator clips, 1 cotton wrist sweat band, and aluminum foil to wrap around the sweat band. The things I'm doing differently from Mark is that I'm using a lower voltage (12 volts), and I'm connecting the positive terminal of the battery to the pan, and the negative terminal to the sweat band. I had considered doing a voltage swap since it is mentioned on many different web sites. However, the method use everywhere else is the two-hand method, so if the polarity of the current is important, then it makes sense to swap the voltage. Since I'm using the one hand method, I figure doing a voltage swap really doesn't make sense, and will not help to answer whether the polarity matters. Since I received the batteries and the alligator clips on Monday Feb 20, I decided to do my treatment on Mondays, Wednesdays, Fridays, and Sundays. Basically every other day, except two days in a row on Sunday and Monday. I started with 10 minutes because I really felt it the first time I tried. Then I increased it to 15 min, 20 min, and now I'm doing between 25 to 30 min. Yesterday I had my 7th treatment. So I think it's too early to tell whether my left hand is more prone to skin injury or not, but for now, I don't feel the skin on my left hand is any worse than my right hand, other than a very normal dryness to it that I would expect from reduced sweating. Time will tell! I use cold tap water, and I have a drinking glass that I fill the pan with, so I always use roughly the same amount of water. I don't add anything to the water, that was what I'm going to try if this didn't work at first. Honestly I really didn't think it would work so soon. I purposedly used a very bare-bone set up, because if it didn't work, then I can play with one variable at a time. Some of the things I had planned to experiment with are: 1. increasing the voltage. 2. add salt or baking soda to the water. 3. change the polarity. But now, it seems like I don't have do any of that. I plan to start treatment with my right hand, but I will use the reverse polarity on that hand, so we can at least answer the question if polarity matters or not. For science!
|
|
|
Post by MarkAnderson on Mar 4, 2017 21:01:58 GMT -7
Great summary! You've inspired me to get back in the (aluminum) saddle.
And that's a really great photo, my compliments to the photographer.
|
|
|
Post by aikibujin on Mar 4, 2017 22:31:31 GMT -7
Great summary! You've inspired me to get back in the (aluminum) saddle. And that's a really great photo, my compliments to the photographer. Ha! I think that's a subtle hint that I should credit my photos? Point taken. I think the one-hand method you came up with is pretty revolutionary. I did a lot of reading on iontophoresis, and no one else had come up with something similar. It really allows for this type of experiment to figure out what really works, you're not applying the current across your body (safer in my opinion), and it's much more tolerable to be able to do other stuff with the other hand while one hand is under treatment. If I have to sit there with both hands in pans for half an hour, I don't think I can stand the boredom.
|
|