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Post by tetrault on Mar 12, 2017 7:36:08 GMT -7
How do you avoid getting pink raw finger tips (to the point of ripping, bruising, and bleeding) when training on the tiny, plastic holds that mimic many "real" outdoor routes? Is it possible to avoid this by developing a certain type of skin? What it that? Thicker and harder? Or is this maybe the dynamic issue of sweating while climbing, so no matter what type of skin I have, it becomes too soft when actually climbing? Or is the solution more likely to spend time on slightly larger holds on a steeper wall? I believe this has been talked about before; that plastic climbing should be a little steeper than real climbing. Or would it be the most dreaded solution of all; more rest? Background: With my home wall completed, going through my 2nd "season" of training spending less and less time at a commercial gym. Made it a point to keep the walls less steep in order to keep the holds as small as possible. Concurrently, I have begun to shift some focus away from ARC and towards LB. Have not done much systematic bouldering in the past, as it seemed silly to me to spend time lunging for jugs in a gym cave only to fall off my latest traditional "proj" getting mentally gripped on small footholds. My skin is generally dry (I think), glassy, and will split open between the DIP and PIP, as if cut by a razor blade, even when I stick to a strict regimen of nearly year-round salve and wearing gloves in cold weather. I try to minimize any product on my finger tips though, as they seem to have more "typical" moisture content and will actually produce some sweat when climbing. I have been able to deal with 2nd pad splits, climbing/training through these injuries with tape, etc. However, now a new, more dire issue has developed. My finger tips can not seem to handle the tiny holds that I have been ARCing on, often getting pink, raw and quite uncomfortable, and have been pushed to the point of bleeding and bruising when LB'ing. thanks!
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Post by Charlie S on Mar 12, 2017 16:16:34 GMT -7
Sounds like you're ARCing perhaps too intensely?
As for the rest, how long have you been climbing? Sometimes it takes the skin quite a while to adjust. I'll lightly bruise my finger tips usually near the end of an HB season or a really hard Limit Boulder session.
I'm seeing people get psyched on Rhino Skin. Haven't used it but might be worth checking out.
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Post by Lundy on Mar 12, 2017 18:26:45 GMT -7
I've been climbing for 23 years and still get bruises in my tips from hard crimping either on the hangboard or limit bouldering. I'm not sure it's avoidable for some people. Not sure about the bleeding, though -- is it a visible split, or more just oozing puss? The former is tough, and probably a moisture issue, the latter is common, and maybe something your skin just needs to build up to dealing with.
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Post by tetrault on Mar 13, 2017 6:05:54 GMT -7
Sounds like you're ARCing perhaps too intensely? As for the rest, how long have you been climbing? Sometimes it takes the skin quite a while to adjust. I'll lightly bruise my finger tips usually near the end of an HB season or a really hard Limit Boulder session. I'm seeing people get psyched on Rhino Skin. Haven't used it but might be worth checking out. I suppose I could be ARCing too intensely, but I am rarely falling, and trying to keep a high level of pump to stress-proof whatever aspect of technique I am focused on. Either way, I may just tape up for my ARC warmups. Though, hat may trap sweat and soften my finger tips for the harder remainder of the workouts. Been climbing for 7 years or so, but again, there has been a recent transition from a commercial gym with giant holds to a home wall with significantly smaller holds. So, this could be the issue; it simply takes time to adjust. I am very hesitant to use a product when I am not quite sure yet the exact skin deficiency I have nor the exact results I am looking for (other than not ripped open and bloody). thanks
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Post by tetrault on Mar 13, 2017 6:21:24 GMT -7
I've been climbing for 23 years and still get bruises in my tips from hard crimping either on the hangboard or limit bouldering. I'm not sure it's avoidable for some people. Not sure about the bleeding, though -- is it a visible split, or more just oozing puss? The former is tough, and probably a moisture issue, the latter is common, and maybe something your skin just needs to build up to dealing with. Ok thanks. It sounds like the bruising does just happen. That's fine. These are visible splits with bleeding. Seem to stay with me for the entire season, reopening if I stop babying them, or if I am too impatient with my workout schedule. after a full rest day yesterday and a big dollops of salve and cotton gloves overnight: I have had oozing as well; I can remember a specific recent LB session where it was happening on my left hand tips. Ended my session early, but it did not affect future sessions. I will have to pay better attention next season to nail down the skin conditions leading up to the visible split when starting from relatively healthy skin.
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Post by MarkAnderson on Mar 13, 2017 13:52:28 GMT -7
Its fairly normal for your skin to be the limiting factor in a LB session if you're making a point to use small holds. Almost all of my sessions end when my skin runs out (while I still have energy and psych to continue). While this is frustrating in the moment, its probably good in the long run because it keeps me from over-training. ARCing can be hard on my skin too, but over the last few years I've been trying to ARC on steeper terrain, so any skin issues are usually on the 2nd or 3rd pads.
All that said, your skin looks heinous in that pic! You're wise to seek counsel. Is that happening suddenly? It seems likely that you would notice your skin getting progressively worse before it gets to the point where it's bleeding. I examine my pads literally every time I step off the wall (usually before I re-chalk). I have clippers and sanding block ready to trim any trouble areas, and when I see a pad degrade to a certain point* I either tape the pad or end the session, regardless of the time/goals/etc [*how do you know when to quite early or tape? --> experience, mostly bad experience].
As for terrain, it's great to use small holds, but you can only use them so much in a single session. So mix in some problems that are challenging on larger holds (usually by making the holds further apart, facing the wrong way, or slopey). Try to avoid using jagged small holds. With a few exceptions, most of my small holds are smooth, like the e-Grips Dual-Tex, which have relatively fine texture and rounded edges (though even these can cause mini-flappers if you over-do it). If the texture on your holds is too rough, sand them down a bit (also easy to over-do, so experiment first on a non-essential part of the hold).
Based on that photo, you will probably be taping your pads for a month or so, and it would be unwise to attempt any drying interventions for this season. However, once your skin is fully recovered and you have some down time, it might help to start experimenting with some interventions like topical ointments, sanding or Iontophoresis (many threads on these topics).
ETA: Also, what are the temps like where you are training? Is there anything you can do to make it colder?
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Post by tetrault on Mar 18, 2017 6:23:36 GMT -7
Thanks, Mark. I probably should be more mature about ending a session based on skin factors. There have been quite a few Hangboard sessions that I had what seemed to be splits threatening to open at any moment, but have finished the workout in the clear. Plenty of times not so lucky. I guess LB is different, and less likely to end well when gambling with skin! For my LB session following the pics from the previous post, I tried to pay better attention to what is going on, and take some more pics along the way. Outside temps have been super cold here in New England (this session was during the big snowstorm we had earlier this week). I had accidentally left the heat on in my climbing shed for longer than I care to admit, so it was nice and toasty inside, which also might mean the relative humidity was lower than usual. Lately, I have been performing my ARC warmup in a puffy jacket, and bouldering in a light jacket and hat, but this session was tee shirt bouldering. Left hand immediately after ARC warmup: You can see some dry/hard fins/scales on my middle finger tip. Left hand immediately after Boulder "ladder": You can see some of the hard/dry scaley appearance on my middle finger tip. I sand these between burns to avoid cracks forming in between the "scales" if that makes sense. Also was sanding my index finger tip to try to keep the tiny rip from opening further. Left hand immediately after 80 min LB: Was hoping for a longer session, but was trying to be mature and stopped based on skin conditions. Can see index and middle pad getting thin where I was performing what I think is preventative/preemptive sanding. Can also see a thin spot on my ring finger from sliding off the same hold many times in a row. I would have never considered ending a session based on my ring finger condition in the past, but maybe I should in the future. Based on my left hand, I am thinking that excessive moisture is not my problem. It seems that the need? to sand down the dry/hard spots ends up thinning my skin into the "too thin" and "pink" zone. Maybe I should dial the chalk use back? Right hand post to follow...
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Post by tetrault on Mar 18, 2017 6:47:58 GMT -7
Right hand post Boulder "ladder": My pinky pad is a littlest thin and pink and overall not in great shape from the previous few sessions. Unfortunately, I realize now that the picture may not show it, but the beginnings of a diagonal crack in my index pad had me sanding (maybe excessively) during the end of the warmup and through the LB session. Right hand after LB session: Ended the session based on my index finger condition. Looking back, with no emotional ties to sending a 2-move plastic problem, I would say I should have probably ended the session sooner. I think you can see the split forming in the picture. I felt I could not sand the pad down anymore without it becoming too thin, and any more climbing may open the split. I ended up sanding down my index finger tip the next morning until the split was no longer visible, which left the area quite pink and thin for 3 days, and still not great today (4th day). Mark - As far as happening suddenly; no, i guess not. In the past, I have climbed through this condition, because *sometimes* the split doesn't open. I realize that this sounds silly, but it has always made sense in the moment. None of the holds I am using lately seem too sharp, except a few of the Atomik small simple crimps set 1 link, and maybe some of the egrips buttons. What you said about taping for a month is also an eye-opener for me, as I was getting frustrated, assuming these types of skin issues should be healing much quicker. Thanks. After really paying attention to my sanding habits and what my fingers are looking like, I am thinking that my skin is too dry and thin vs too moist.
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Post by rhinoskinsolutions on Aug 12, 2017 18:04:28 GMT -7
Looks as though your skin may be to moist. How often do you chalk? Having drier skin environment may be beneficial for you. Using a product like Rhino Skin Dry Roll On may let your tips hold up longer.
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