Stamina

[markdixon]

Curious about your thoughts on stamina training. Specifically, having enough stamina to make multiple red point project attempts over the course of a day. 
I used the SCC CIR/VIR workouts last year and thought it helped me move up from maybe 2 decent attempts to 3-4/day. Which makes a huge difference in getting stuff accomplished! 
But where in the cycle would you put that kind of workout? It's a bit intense for the ARC phase. Maybe PE? But I found it took a lot out of me, had to be really careful not to overtrain- which is already a challenge for me in the PE phase.
Sorry if you covered this in your book, have only been through it once and my memory isn't what it used to be.

PS Nice to meet you Mike and Janelle at Primo. Hope the boys had fun in CO. And good luck to Mark on his project!

[MarkAnderson]

Mark, nice to see you at the crag today...too bad we could hear each other over the raging "creek"!

I view stamina the same way I view endurance: as a trade-off against power. Most of the time, I'd rather have 2 burns a day at my peak power level than 4 burns a day one notch below. My philosophy is that when I'm at peak power, I will be able to send my project in fewer attempts, so I don't need as many attempts per day to send in the same number of calendar days. That's a big assumption though--it would be interesting to study this and try to determine the "optimal" number of burns per day for projects below a climber's absolute limit (theoretically, at your absolute limit you should only get one realistic attempt per day, maybe only one per week!)

However, if I'm going on a road trip to a new crag where my goal is essentially to send as many routes as possible, it makes sense to train for more stamina. My approach in these situations is to use Route Intervals, at some point in my PE phase, performing relatively more sets on relatively less powerful routes. I think if your intent was to "permanently" improve your stamina (as opposed to training for higher stamina for a short period of time to facilitate a trip), it would make sense to increase volume (accepting a corresponding decrease in intensity) throughout your training cycle(s). The goal being to increase your basic work capacity.

I think you hit the nail on the head that over-training is a major concern with stamina training. I would certainly add some extra rest days in until you figure out exactly what your body can handle, and I would expect the lots of this training will eventually cause your power to drop off a cliff (at least that's been my experience). Fine if you're climbing at the Red, not so great at many other crags.

[slimshaky]

this is a good question, and it will probably depend a lot on your goals. i think the CIR bouldering workouts are pretty helpful for goals where you are trying to send a lot of routes at a grade about 2 to 3 letter grades under your max RP grade. last year my goal was to send as many routes at grade 'X' or above as possible. i incorporated some of these CIR bouldering workouts and i think they were helpful. in particular, i tend to be kind of cautious my first go on a hardish route, try to figure out the moves, and send 2nd or third try. for my particular goal last year, i think the overall game plan worked really well.

on the other hand, if you are trying to break into a new grade, i think the sub-maximal efforts won't be very helpful (and possibly have negative results). my goals for this year, or possibly next spring, will really require a big jump in physical ability. one of the things i have found - trying hard is really hard. if you are used to putting out sub-maximal efforts, it is a real mental jump to go into full beast mode. for example, when i try to limit boulder at the gym i have a real hard time giving a 100% effort. it is like my mind is always trying to figure out an easier way so that i don't have to try so hard. kind of frustrating, but i will keep working on it.

[markdixon]

Thanks for the replies.

Mark, congratulations on Berreta!
That was a really nice day. The high water covered up voices, but also almost all the road noise. We had Primo to ourselves all day, must have been the same at the Armory.

Your argument that stamina workouts are basically PE intervals (with a long rest interval) is persuasive. So I guess it would make sense to include them in that phase. On the other hand, if using them to increase work capacity, then I could see a value at the start of the training process, so as to benefit from that increased work capacity in the rest of the phases.

I am not very experienced redpointing, and often need an inordinately large number of burns to figure out the most effective sequence, which is why more stamina seems attractive.