Help with weight loss, and how to determine my ideal weight

[tradmike]

So i'll start out by saying, I'm a big guy not fat( i could lose some though) but just a bigger muscular guy for the most part.  I've been trying to lose weight, I'm 6 feet tall and  dropped from 215 down to 195 with a goal of 190 and for some reason i just cant get below 195.  And last time i stepped on the scale i was over 200 again which pisses me off.
I Did notice also that i climbed way better at 195 then i have ever climbed before.
       My goal is to lose the weight and to climb a devils lake 10a on lead called sometimes Crack by November of next year.


I have been looking at the book and i'm gathering just eats lots of greens and chicken and very little carbs.  Just wondering what has worked for everyone, I love Chicken but hate fish so tuna is out of the picture.  Just trying to get some ideas of what works that doesn't become boring and the same thing every day.

Lastly I am curious as to what people think is a good safe weight for strength to weight ratio for a 6 foot guy for climbing.   

[tradmike]

No one Just looking for a little help or words of motivation

[Charlie S]

Not an authority on nutrition whatsoever, but...

I'm 6 ft and 165. Though I bounce around a lot between 162-168. I do not have a small build. I have to be very conscious of my intake as I will balloon up if I don't pay attention. I drink almost a gallon of water a day Fall-Spring and at least a gallon in the summer (part of this is geographic, being at a high elevation and very low humidity).

I used to be 185. I was 175 4 years ago.

Portion control is a big deal. Avoiding seconds when possible is a big deal.

I started seeing gains (or weight loss, however you want to phrase it) by cutting out juice in the morning and evening to zero juice. My milk consumption went from a glass at every meal to maybe 2 glasses a week. Went from having meat at every meal to meat once a day at most and more like every other day.

I also noticed that larger breakfasts help cut the desire for snacking in the middle of the afternoon. But this is person specific. Some people can go eating almost nothing until dinner.

Remove easy-to-access food from your workplace. Got a vending machine? Don't carry cash, then. Have someone who brings in donuts multiple times a week? Gorge yourself for a month and then determine you really don't like donuts. Then it's easy to say no.

Find distractions to keep your mind off food, whether it's an activity or mental exercise.

[cardiffsurfer]

I'm just a hair under 5'11" and currently mid 160's, but I've bounced between 180-205 for most of my adult life.  It takes decent effort to stay below 180 (I love to eat).  I also have more muscle mass than your typical climber, after a few years of barbell training.

Everyone is different, but I would think you should be able to reach 180 without terrible difficulty.  I'll tell you what works best for me, and this is after 10+ years of experimenting with different techniques to lose weight and maintain a healthy weight (I'm 39 now).

Intermittent Fasting.  I rarely eat breakfast, taking my first meal around 11-12.  It might take some getting used to, but I have found that it is a great way to cut an entire meal out with little impact on what I eat or how hungry I feel for the rest of the day.  It's a great way to reduce total caloric intake, which is really all that matters. 

Minimal snacking.  In general, I don't buy or keep snacks at home.  It's too easy and tempting to cheat. 

Minimal cardio.  I use to run and do crossfit-style workouts in an effort to burn calories.  I found that this also led to me eating more.  Now, I do minimal cardio other than what I get from climbing and surfing.   

Lots of protein and even fat during meals, but minimal carbs.  Protein is filling and will keep you feeling "full" for longer.  I happen to like tuna so I eat a lot of it.  Also a lot of lean lunch meat, beef jerky, and nuts.

Once or twice a week, I just eat whatever I want and enjoy myself.  For example, tonight I am making pizza and will probably knock back an entire 16" pie myself.  I find that I need a psychological break every few days to stay strong on a diet, and if you're good for 3-4 days in a row it's no big deal if you eat whatever you want occasionally.  Within reason, of course. 

Good luck.  Oh, and weigh yourself regularly and keep a log of your progress.  It keeps you honest and motivated.

[tradmike]

Man this losing fat and getting to an ideal climbing weight is tough as hell for me. Why is it so hard to stick to a healthy meal plan and drop weight. I'm trying to find some other good sources of protein etc. Have tried the sample meal plan but found that it was getting boring real fast, eating just chicken everyday. Would doing some cardio help, or would it jsut make me more hungry later like suggested. Right now i'm sitting at 205 and would love to get down to 185 for my goal climb next spring. !85 seems impossible to me as i have not weighed that since probably middle school and i'm 36 years old now.

[iepsje]

I am not an expert, but loosing weight (and not loosing to much muscle) can be really hard and you need a lot of determination. Besides weight/length ratio, it can be good to get an estimation of your fat percentage (many fitness centres can estimate, or a doctor/ dietician). You say you are muscular and not fat, if that is really true and your fat percentage is below 15% you do not have much fat to loose.. But before you can make this assumption you should (in my opinion) try to get an estimation of your fat percentage.

Further, keeping track of your weight and girth (measuring your waist, legs etc) motivates a lot. DO it regularly and be honest with yourself, do not cheat
Also keeping track of what you eat, when you eat and why you eat helps a lot. Buy a kitchen scale and start measuring everything you eat and log it (myfitnesspal.com for example), do not cheat include everything Many people underestimate what they eat (I did/do as well).
Try to eat sitting down at an table, with no distractions, no television watching or mobile phone. Just eat, enjoy eating en chew. In this way you eat more conscious, resulting in that you will feel more satisfied (full) and overeating will less likely happen.
Think about what you eat and why you eat it, especially candy/chocolate etc, do you really want it, do you need it, or is it an habit or a treat.

If you want more specific advice on what you eat and whether it is enough/too much and what you can improve, give us some more details on your meals and drinks and your movement-patterns.



ps. sorry for my English mistakes, I am not a native speaker and do not have the time to go over it again and again. I hope it is readable though.

[bk]

I lost about 15 lbs using the standard advice, but I've been stuck at 185. I'm trying a version of intermittent fasting where you cut calories significantly for two days a week (600), and eat normally on other days. There's a growing body of evidence that this type of fasting can help with weight loss, and more importantly (for me) lower cholesterol.

I'm only a week in, but I'm finding the fasting surprisingly easy and I'm down 2.5 lbs. It's also nice that I only have to carefully plan (read calorie count) two to four meals per week. I'm hoping this will help be get past my plateau.

www.dailymotion.com/video/xvdbtt_eat-fast-live-longer-hd_shortfilms
www.amazon.ca/The-FastDiet-Healthy-Intermittent-Fasting/dp/1442366621

[cardiffsurfer]

For those interested in becoming leaner, tips and techniques, and the science behind weight loss, I recommend you check out Lyle McDonald's website:

www.bodyrecomposition.com/

Lots of science-based info here, and explained in a way that is easy to understand (with no gimmicks). Enough reading to keep you busy for weeks.

If you're struggling to lose weight, educate yourself, first and foremost!

[Cody]

I appreciate this question. I am a guy who also struggles with weight. I am an avid trail runner, but the last few years I have not been able to lose any weight at all, even though I have increased the distance and regularity of running. Thanks to the Anderson's, I have found a diet that really works and makes me feel great every day. Ive never found anything so empowering as losing weight. And I don't run any more--at least for now. So far I have lost 40 pounds (In one season, basically)--I actually had to buy a new harness and wardrobe.
Here's what I have done:
First I found out what my daily caloric needs are, by going to any one of a million "caloric calculators" on the internet. When I started I was 217 pounds. I figured I wanted to get down to about 174 pounds (I reached 177, though gained about 5 pounds over the holidays). From that i guessed that my caloric intake could be about 2200/day, based on my goal weight. Of course you can play around with these figures, and the more you practice the easier it becomes--I've dialed it down to 2200 on rest days and 2500 on work days, training days, or climbing days.
Next I simply copied the diet plan that the book (RCTM) suggests on page 213. I did some simple mathematics and adjusted the amount of food I eat according to my caloric needs. I bought a food scale, and started shopping at Costco. Im saving a ton of money on food, and making everyone in my life jealous by losing so much weight. I think that this diet is the best diet available. I've researched quite a bit since starting. This diet works because it keeps my blood sugar steady, and allows me to eat very often--every hour or so. Not only that, the food is so delicious. We buy the organic spring mix from Costco and Follow Your Heart balsamic vinaigrette from Whole Foods and there are actually few things I would rather eat. I do find myself very hungry at night, but I am living at a1000 calorie deficit every day and haven't killed myself or anybody else around me yet. Sure I get grumpy, but the weight comes off like magic. I can lose 2 pounds per week pretty regularly.
In my first season using the periodic training program, I basically reached all of my life long goals in climbing. I went from a timid 5.8 leader to a pretty solid 10 trad leader in Zion and Joshua Tree. I believe that base fitness and dieting are the two leading elements in my improvement so far, although I have taken every phase of the periodic training very seriously. I just started the strength phase in Season Two and am pleasantly surprised by the increase in strength. I can't wait to start limit bouldering again here in two weeks. Im pretty sure I will send the tough v4's which alluded me last season, and maybe even put down a couple of the 5's. One year ago I spent a month floundering in the same gym and was having a hard time climbing v2.
In the long term I am guessing that 164 is going to be my ideal performance weight, however I don't think I can know that until I actually get there. 4 months of strict dieting got me some great results, and I am really glad that the program is periodic because it means that I don't have to always be so strict with my diet. I know that a couple of weeks or months of discipline each season will allow me to maintain a low, healthy weight.

[MarkAnderson]

Cody,

That's really awesome--super inspiring. Thanks for sharing your story. Good luck with your upcoming season, it sounds like you're going to be crushing!
Mark

[Ming]

I'm pretty small - 4'11" and 88 pounds, and female. I was 94 pounds when I started the training, and I was starting right off the couch. I have a tendency to put on muscle weight easily when I start a new sport and didn't want to put more weight on (though my forearms are getting huge!). I figured it wouldn't hurt to be a few pounds lighter and get to know my body in this sense. It's empowering to be able to make an active decision about where I perform best.

I found that the diet template as suggested on page 213 of the training manual to be very helpful, cause I know exactly what I'm eating and when. I'm an indecisive person, so constantly having to make healthful decisions and calculate calories drives me nuts. I can write it all out once, but don't tell me to do the math every single time I put something in my mouth. This is what I did: I took the template that is provided in the book and adjusted the calories and grams to suit my weight goals. As Cody mentioned, you can figure out your maintenance calories by finding a calculator on the internet, then take off 20% to get your caloric intake to diet, and then figure the percentage of your diet calories compared to the calories on the template and adjust the grams and calories accordingly.

I have a running list of substitutions for fruit and snacks (in grams) that are equivalent in calories to what's on the template. At first the diet didn't taste too good (sardines and bad baked fish and runny balsamic vinaigrette), but being rigorous about it helps cause if you're stuck eating this stuff, you will find ways to make the food taste really good.

These are some specific favorites, after much trial and error:

Whole Foods:
Wild Brine kimchee on salads (super low calories - all their flavors are great)
Sonoma Brinery sliced pickles - bread and butter
Bon Breads marbled rye bread
Follow Your Heart balsamic vinaigrette (the marinade sauce, not the salad dressing) - the best stuff I swear
365 (Whole Foods brand) salsa (refrigerated) are faves

Costco:
rotisserie chicken and canned chicken at Costco are killer
red and orange cherry tomatoes
twice a year they have fresh sockeye salmon for $6.99/lb - not farmed!

others:
cilantro and thin sliced green onions on salads
red and orange bell peppers instead of the green
heirloom tomatoes
salsa instead of tomatoes
extra cucumbers
pepper and salt and other spices as needed

None of my suggestions are revolutionary, but in experimenting with good ingredients, your meals can be the best salads you've ever eaten. And I LOVE FOOD! On our cheat days (every 3 or 4 days or preferably 1x/wk), we always end up missing our normal diet food. I have a feeling our salads are going to continue to get better and better.

Mostly, I've found that I have complete control over my weight, up or down, which is something new, and coveted. It turns out to be very knowable, and therefore, predictable.

[Ming]

Also, for the ladies out there - I have found that I can only diet two weeks out of the month. Something happens the week before and the week of my period and I turn into cookie monster.  I've read that this is normal and even healthy to adjust what we eat in order to regulate hormones.  But it's a new arena of experimentation for me, so any suggestions welcome.

I keep eating on the template as normal but I add Taza stone ground chocolate (vanilla) or Brookestone Acai chocolate pieces, put almond butter on my wasa crackers, cut an extra serving or two of the morning veggie snack, add an extra piece of toast and scramble my egg in the morning, etc, and I'm able to maintain my weight (as measured before my period, and then after). During my period, I retain about 3 or 4 pounds in water weight and I'm bloated and I struggle with summoning the strength to train, so the problem is a lot bigger than food (I've considered posting another thread about this too). Anybody else have this experience?

[climber511]

I started lifting weights in 1959 - started climbing in 1983 - which I guess makes me pretty ..........well - old at 66 . I'm 6' 2" and weigh within a few pounds of 200# on any given day. I'm about 9% body fat currently. In the late 80s - when I was climbing at my best I weighed around 183 or 4. Retirement and less walking (I was a walking mailman) let me push up my body weight to it's current levels with a lot of gym time. I really like the strength this size gives me but it has seriously affected my climbing. I've been thinking of what body weight I think will give me a good compromise between maintaining muscle mass and better performance on the rock that is also realistic. My current size makes me a quite skinny lifter and pretty darn big climber. I'm curious as to others thoughts as to my "target" weight of 188#. I know to really climb bigger numbers I should aim for 175 or so but I don't find that realistic as to any other goals I have. Thoughts?

[MarkAnderson]

Jan 22, 2015 12:30:12 GMT -7 climber511 said:

I started lifting weights in 1959 - started climbing in 1983 - which I guess makes me pretty ..........well - old at 66 . I'm 6' 2" and weigh within a few pounds of 200# on any given day. I'm about 9% body fat currently. In the late 80s - when I was climbing at my best I weighed around 183 or 4. Retirement and less walking (I was a walking mailman) let me push up my body weight to it's current levels with a lot of gym time. I really like the strength this size gives me but it has seriously affected my climbing. I've been thinking of what body weight I think will give me a good compromise between maintaining muscle mass and better performance on the rock that is also realistic. My current size makes me a quite skinny lifter and pretty darn big climber. I'm curious as to others thoughts as to my "target" weight of 188#. I know to really climb bigger numbers I should aim for 175 or so but I don't find that realistic as to any other goals I have. Thoughts?

Sounds like a classic "jack of all trades" dilemma. If my math is correct, it sounds like a 12# weight loss would take you down to 3% body fat (assuming all the weight loss is fat). I wouldn't recommend that, but I infer that you're hoping to drop some muscle mass as well (which shouldn't be too hard at your "experience level"). If I were you I would totally let my legs go and weight-train like a gymnast. You can still experience the joy of honing your body, but using exercises that are relatively specific to climbing. But, my priorities are different than yours.



I'm curious, what type of climbing do you like? Vertical or less climbing is far less weight-dependent than steeply overhanging climbing. A good compromise might be to gravitate towards less-steep climbs.

[climber511]

Mark - just as you expect I like vertical to slightly less than - overhangs wreck my elbows if done very often. My favorite climbing is actually long moderate alpine routes of moderate difficulty (5.7) to easy 5.9) but that's usually a once a year trip type thing so I hope that following a little of The New Alpinism book for the endurance work and your book for the rest along with the weight loss plan I can climb better on the weekend climbing and still stronger in the mountains. My weight room work has changed quite a bit with this in mind. It's a lot of "balance" work to get more even strength across joints and to strengthen and stabilize old injuries etc along with mobility and flexibility - both of which I need these days. As much as I hate it - I'm going to have to lose muscle mass - I have set the goal of 188# and 10% body fat. Any ideas on how to reach that goal is certainly welcome - I'm thinking stapling my lips shut might be a start .