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Post by aikibujin on Mar 7, 2017 22:31:22 GMT -7
Oh damn, can I jump on this thread? Ok, I did a frame-by-frame analysis of your video (I just love campusing!), and I think it's not a timing issue for you, it's lack of explosive power on the second pull (which is probably what we all struggle on). For your first move (L1-L3), you had a good explosive pull, so between the time you release your left hand (the left-most frame in the photo below) and the time you latched rung 3, your center of gravity (approximately where the blue dot is) moved up a couple of inches. Also, by the time you released your left hand, you've already pulled fairly high up on your arms (what I'm trying to show with the blue line connecting your right shoulder and elbow). Combing these two things allowed the reach to rung 3. Contrast that to when you release your right hand on the second move (photos below) and the time you latched rung 4.5 with your right hand, your center of gravity didn't move up (or down) at all. So you're basically locked off with your left hand while reaching with your right, which is why you kicked your feet to the left to counterbalance that reach (I do exactly the same thing when I looked at a video of myself). Now if you had enough explosive power (to generate upward momentum) and it's just a timing issue, I would expect your center of gravity to still move up a little. That's why I think it's not a timing issue. Combine this stationary center of gravity with the fact that you haven't pulled yourself as high as your first move when you released your lower hand (the blue line again), this limited your reach by quite a bit. Like I mentioned, most of us probably struggle on this. It's hard enough to pull explosively with both hands, on the second move where your higher hand is doing most of the pulling, it's almost impossible to pull explosively for most. There are two things I've been doing to work around this. The first is working the second move in isolation like I mentioned before. This helps build that lock-off strength, but you'll be doing the second move more statically (that's how a lot of people do it: pull up, lock-off, and reach). The other thing you can try is to use momentum from your first move. I kind of explain it a little in this thread. You don't set up a big recoil for the second move like a lot of people do, so I think you're already moving in that direction, but you still pause a little too long (maybe to control the swing) between the first and second move to use your momentum effectively.
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Post by aikibujin on Mar 7, 2017 22:47:31 GMT -7
It looks like the last suggestion of working on the second move only and not worrying about latching the rung would be most beneficial here, so I will give this a shot as a way to train lockoffs, In my opinion, that's not what you need to work on right now. I have suggested that exercise to you before, but now that I've seen you campus, I would not suggest that exercise for now. I think you have a bit of injury potential in your current campusing form, the movement of your head and your shoulder on the first move is pretty worrisome. I would again suggest working just the first move, until you can get the timing and movement dialed, so you're not dropping down on your shoulder or snapping your head back.
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Post by tetrault on Mar 8, 2017 4:00:19 GMT -7
Seems like some excellent analysis in the thread above with the frame by frame pics, aikibujin. Something we should all probably do with our own training/climbing videos. Thank you!
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Post by ehowell on Mar 8, 2017 6:52:56 GMT -7
Ok, I did a frame-by-frame analysis of your video Aikibujin, this is really awesome. Much appreciated. Are you just doing screen grabs or do you use software for this? So I was back in the gym last night, and while I agree with everything you're saying, I do think timing is at least a bit of a factor. I had my best night ever on the campus board, finally hitting 1-3-5 on small rungs (well almost, fell on the match). The key was slowing down after hitting 3 and before making the move to 5. Now, the reason I'm swinging in the first place may very well be that I lack explosive power on the small holds -- definitely true -- but timing seemed to matter as well. Hitting 5 on small rungs has seemed like a pipe dream for a while, but going to DBC armed with your first suggestion seemed to have made a difference. Plus that original video is from last season, so hopefully I'm a little stronger too! Alexandra -- sorry to hijack your thread!
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Post by aikibujin on Mar 8, 2017 7:53:06 GMT -7
Seems like some excellent analysis in the thread above with the frame by frame pics, aikibujin. Something we should all probably do with our own training/climbing videos. Thank you! Thanks. I just think it's really fun, makes me feel like I know what I'm talking about! So I was back in the gym last night, and while I agree with everything you're saying, I do think timing is at least a bit of a factor. I had my best night ever on the campus board, finally hitting 1-3-5 on small rungs (well almost, fell on the match). The key was slowing down after hitting 3 and before making the move to 5. Congrats! Awesome to hear that you made improvement so quickly. What I meant by “timing issue” was specifically when you released your lower hand, but of course timing is huge in pretty much every part of campusing. By slowing down the transition between the two moves, you’re essentially doing the second move more statically, in other words, once your swing stops and your momentum dies down, you’re at the same position as starting from free-hanging from rung 1 and rung 3. This is great, it’s what I do too: first I work the second move in isolation, then I add the first move but still keeping the second move fairly static. Once I can do that reliably, I then try to decrease the transition time between the first and second move. If you watch the video of Mark doing the 1-5-8, he barely pauses when he latch rung 5 before he’s flying toward rung 8. I think that’s what he means by “training contraction speed”, and I think that’s what we should be aiming for. Oh and I use VLC player on my computer to watch videos, keyboard short cut E allows me to advance the video one frame at a time (can’t step back unfortunately), Shift+S takes a snapshot of the frame. I then just combine the video stills in a photo editor. If there's something better out there, I'm all ears.
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Post by jetjackson on Mar 8, 2017 12:28:03 GMT -7
Philosophical question...
Does improving campus technique actually translate to climbing, or are we just getting better at campusing?
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Post by ehowell on Mar 8, 2017 12:36:00 GMT -7
Philosophical question... Does improving campus technique actually translate to climbing, or are we just getting better at campusing? Great question, and I think the answer can go either way depending on how you use it. For instance, here in the Front Range, if you're trying to maximize your max ladder on large rungs, that's probably not time well spent. With a few exceptions, the climbing here is on small holds. So I tried to get to the small rungs as fast as possible. Basically by my third campus session each season, I'm feeling primed for sending. I don't do much limit bouldering in the gym, so I'm not sure how it would go if I didn't campus for a season.
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Post by aikibujin on Mar 8, 2017 17:18:15 GMT -7
Philosophical question... Does improving campus technique actually translate to climbing? No... and I think I'm a pretty good example of that. BUT campusing is a great drill for specific things like power, hand-eye coordination, using momentum, etc. So if those are your areas of weakness, then campus training may have a pretty big impact on your climbing.
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Post by alexandra on Mar 8, 2017 20:08:56 GMT -7
One-arm assisted hangs on the hangboard are a good option because they are specific to the position that you will encounter climbing. I disagree with Mark and think that a lot of your uncontrolled form comes from a lack of finger strength. I have noticed that my shoulder acts as a fail-safe for my fingers when they could be overloaded. You can test this by trying a lockoff on a jug and a lockoff on an edge. My shoulder drops out when trying to lock off on the edge even though it can support my body while hanging the jug. I would recommend ceasing campusing without your feet for a while until you can tighten up and control your form. Regarding the lockoff in a jug vs edge. I tried two arm lockoffs from the small edge (small side of small vder) with semiclosed crimp grip and also from the edge with open hand. I found no difference in my form between the lockoff on the edges and the jug. As for one arm lockoff, I can't do a one arm lockoff on the pull-up bar so trying it on the edge would be pointless. Were you referring to two arm lockoff or one arm when you noticed the difference in your shoulder form?
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Post by brendann on Mar 8, 2017 21:06:32 GMT -7
I was referring to one-arm lock-off since that is the situation where your fingers could become overloaded.
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Post by Chris W on Mar 9, 2017 5:48:47 GMT -7
So... since I've been browsing this thread, I decided to finally try filming myself to check out my technique, both on some boulder problems in the barn as well as my campus board. I was a bit disappointed. Instead of looking like a bad ass when I climb, I look like a bald gangly spider magically sticking to the wall.
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Post by ehowell on Mar 9, 2017 6:32:28 GMT -7
...I look like a bald gangly spider magically sticking to the wall. Well...at least you're still on the wall!
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Post by Chris W on Mar 9, 2017 11:10:07 GMT -7
That's the funny thing! Looking at the video, it's hard to believe that THAT (my) body somehow sticks! Thanks Rock Prodigy Training Center (and Forge too)!
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Post by tetrault on Mar 9, 2017 14:35:01 GMT -7
So... since I've been browsing this thread, I decided to finally try filming myself to check out my technique, both on some boulder problems in the barn as well as my campus board. I was a bit disappointed. Instead of looking like a bad ass when I climb, I look like a bald gangly spider magically sticking to the wall. There are no extra points for badassery. Sending is sending. I hear you though; I'm like a squirrel in traffic when cruxing. I like to think of it as a great opportunity for improvement.
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Post by aikibujin on Mar 9, 2017 18:49:25 GMT -7
I'm like a squirrel in traffic when cruxing. Can you post a video of that?
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