one arm pull-ups

[alexandra]

Starting a new separate thread based on a discussion hidden in another thread. 
what do people do to achieve One arm pull-ups?
Scojo and I have been discussing on the benefits of Wendler's 5/3/1 adapted for pull-ups.

I will let him explain further if anyone asks, but basically it seems that he has achieved a one arm by following this practice and now I have just started it as well. Will report on progress.

here are two links that specify the process: 

www.t-nation.com/workouts/531-how-to-build-pure-strength
app.paulswartz.net/wendler/#a60

[scojo]

For convenience, for those trying to follow, the discussion about this topic begins here: rockprodigytraining.proboards.com/thread/159/training-success-breakthough-stories?page=12
But discussion of this topic should continue in this thread rather than the other one.

For those that are less trained in heavy pullups, I would suggest following some sort of linear programming first. For example, pick 3 to 5 sets, 3 to 5 reps and increase the resistance by 5 lb. or 2.5 lb. every workout (there are a plethora of linear programming schemes out there). This works great for beginners or if you haven't trained weighted pullups for a while.

The problem I had with the linear programming is the same thing that happens with training for many other things, progress slows down or stagnates. It becomes frustrating to repeat the same weight from workout to workout and it's hard to tell if you're actually getting any stronger. There are some ways to mitigate this issue - resetting the resistance used or changing up the set/rep scheme, but at some point it becomes useful to increase the complexity of your programming.

5/3/1 is just one (I think quite effective) approach for periodized programming - your rep scheme undulates rather than staying the same each workout. The progression is of course much slower than with linear programming, but it's more resistant to plateauing. Though, you will see progress from month to month or week to week rather than from workout to workout.

[srossabi42]

at what point do you switch from weighted pullups to one arms? do you occasionally try a one arm as you train weighted two arm pullups? do you ever remove weight to do one arms? (like what you do on for a hangboard grip that you can't do with bodyweight)

[alexandra]

Another question I had: say you finish a few cycles of 5/3/1 an then after you add 5 lbs every 3 workouts, at some point you reach failure to complete a set. do yo still increase the weight after another 3 workouts or do you repeat that weight for the next week as well until you succeed in all sets and reps? Also, the calculator you mentioned accounts for 6 sets per workout, the 3 first sets with lower resistance. I thought that the 5/3/1 program only consisted of three sets per day, are the original lighter sets necessary or are they just warmups that might not affect things much if you are already warmed up?

[scojo]

Dec 1, 2016 15:23:03 GMT -7 srossabi42 said:

at what point do you switch from weighted pullups to one arms? do you occasionally try a one arm as you train weighted two arm pullups? do you ever remove weight to do one arms? (like what you do on for a hangboard grip that you can't do with bodyweight)

 I'm still running 5/3/1 with weighted pullups - I think it makes sense to continue the program until I stop seeing progress or at least until I can do multiple one-arms.

Yeah, on days that I wasn't doing weighted pullups I would sometimes test myself to see how close I was and to see where my failure point was (it was typically when my arm made a 90 degree angle). 

I have tried one-arms with a pulley. I think it can be an effective way to train for one-arms, but I didn't use this method for a couple of reasons: takes more time, it can be a bit awkward to attach the weight, my primary goal is to become a better climber - the one-arm is more of a benchmark for me.

[srossabi42]

thanks! so you would say weighted pullups are a more climbing specific exercise than the one arms?

[scojo]

Dec 1, 2016 15:30:02 GMT -7 alexandra said:

Another question I had: say you finish a few cycles of 5/3/1 an then after you add 5 lbs every 3 workouts, at some point you reach failure to complete a set. do yo still increase the weight after another 3 workouts or do you repeat that weight for the next week as well until you succeed in all sets and reps? Also, the calculator you mentioned accounts for 6 sets per workout, the 3 first sets with lower resistance. I thought that the 5/3/1 program only consisted of three sets per day, are the original lighter sets necessary or are they just warmups that might not affect things much if you are already warmed up?

If you start out with a conservative training max (eg. your 3 rep max), it should take you many many cycles to reach a failure point. The last set of each workout is taken to failure  (5+, 3+ or 1+). This means you should be able to do at least 5, 3 or 1, but you should do as many as you're able to do. I haven't gotten to the point yet where I can't complete the minimum number of reps, so I can't really provide any wisdom on what to do then. 

Yeah, this particular calculator also gives you warmup sets. The last 3 sets are the workings sets. I usually just warm up with 5 BW pullups (and I usually climb before I do the workout). The warm up sets probably make more sense for bench, squatk etc. Your own experience should probably dictate how you like to warm up. 

[scojo]

Dec 1, 2016 15:52:00 GMT -7 srossabi42 said:

thanks! so you would say weighted pullups are a more climbing specific exercise than the one arms?

My guess is that it would depend on what type of climbing you're doing, but I don't think there is a huge difference in specificity between the two. 

There is a lot of cross-over between the two, so doing one will get you better at the other. How much it helps your climbing depends on your current weaknesses. I'm usually limited by finger strength/endurance, so I don't expect huge short-term improvements in my climbing from either exercise.

[aikibujin]

Dec 1, 2016 15:52:00 GMT -7 srossabi42 said:

thanks! so you would say weighted pullups are a more climbing specific exercise than the one arms?

Yay for parlor tricks! I love them, I think they're just fun to try. While I don't have much to contribute in terms of training for one arm pullups, I do have some opinion on your particular question.

I think the answer depends on how you perform your one arm pullups. Many of us (myself included) do the one arm pullup by turning our body into the arm that's doing the pullup, elbow in front of and tucked very close to our body, so we are more or less looking straight at our thumb. This is really more of a chinup than a pullup, but it is the easiest way to get our chin above our hand (The video below is a good example of this). If you think about it, this movement is more common in crack climbing (in a thumb-up jam) and maybe in climbing an arete. To a lesser extent, you may also see this movement in pulling on an undercling (but the hand is usually much lower and body tension is more important here) or when you need to make a long reach with a twist-lock.







I think doing the one arm pullup with the palm facing forward and elbow pointed more to the side is much harder, I've rarely seen anyone do it that way. The video below is an example of what I'm talking about... he still turns slightly in order to get his chin above his hand, but he is much more "frontal" in his movement compared to the first video. But this is the movement we perform when we do lockoffs (palm forward, elbow to the side), this is a much more common movement in face climbing.






So in my opinion, if I climb a lot of cracks or arete, I may train the one-arm "chinup". Otherwise I would train two-arm pullups (weighted or unweighted) or try the one-arm pullup (with palm facing forward and elbow to the side) because I think they help a lot more with lockoffs.

[alexandra]

Here is an update on the 5/3/1 program so far: I have been doing it for a couple of months now, pretty much right when I started this thread. And even though I cannot do a one arm pull up yet, I just checked my 1 rep max weighed pullup today, and it was 71 lbs. 2 months ago, my 1 rep max was 60 lbs!! If, like people say, you need to be able to do around 2/3 of bodyweight in order to perform a one arm pull up, then I am only 9 lbs away from my goal! (weight around 120 lbs). I have also incorporated some other more one-arm specific exercises as well as static holds in all possible positions of the pullup.

[ehowell]

Jan 23, 2017 11:57:45 GMT -7 alexandra said:

Here is an update on the 5/3/1 program so far: I have been doing it for a couple of months now, pretty much right when I started this thread. And even though I cannot do a one arm pull up yet, I just checked my 1 rep max weighed pullup today, and it was 71 lbs. 2 months ago, my 1 rep max was 60 lbs!! If, like people say, you need to be able to do around 2/3 of bodyweight in order to perform a one arm pull up, then I am only 9 lbs away from my goal! (weight around 120 lbs). I have also incorporated some other more one-arm specific exercises as well as static holds in all possible positions of the pullup.

So Alexandra and others: I'm guessing as you are progressing on the 1 arm PU that you are seeing a corresponding improvement in lock-off capability? I mean, that's ultimately what this is about right?

I've always been pretty shit at pull-ups, and it's probably why I suck at max ladders as well. I've made a point to include some sort of pull exercise into all my strength and power sessions, but I've never really tried any 1-arm progressions. 

I've really been focused more lately on offset pull-ups, because I either am lacking the neuromuscular connection or am just too weak to properly push with my lower hand on big moves on the campus board and on the rock.

[scojo]

Your question made me realize that I almost never do lock-offs. Pull-up power has certainly improved my power long moves (although this wasn't really a weakness to begin with).

[alexandra]

i don't really do many lockoffs explicitly, but I do spend time holding each position of the pullup (with two arms). for example, I would spend 30 sec-1 min with arms at 90 degrees as well as another minute with my chin above the bar. I also do offset assisted one arm pull-ups where I lower slowly. When I checked my one arm lockoff (at some lock off competition that happened after a climbing competition) I could hold the one arm lock off for about 30 sec. It would be interesting to see how this has improved with the one arm training. I ll check and get back to you.

[ehowell]

Interesting. A lot of my projects on the front range usually involve long spans between small holds, and I'm not particularly gifted in the arm length department. The prevailing wisdom is that if you can't reach, get more powerful -- and I completely agree -- but if I can lock-off and grab a hold in a static manner I'd prefer that. Hence my focus on lock-offs. I've generally trained these with the 1-arm row, Frenchy, or offset PU.

BTW holding a 90 degree lock for a minute is strong!

[alexandra]

Just to be clear: i hold 90 degree lock off for a minute with *two* arms, not one arm!!!