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Post by marcusyoya on Apr 4, 2016 9:14:24 GMT -7
Hi-
I have a typical upper body climber movement when climbing. Since I am very short (5'0") and developed climbing in the gym where everything is very dynamic, I have relatively poor footwork when it comes to climbing at my limit. Specifically tapping my flagging 'off' foot when making larger static moves on lock offs for harder climbs outside. I blow through the toes of my shoes in relatively quick intervals when I am in project mode. (3-5 months of weekend climbing).
I am curious on which of the skill development drills I can work on to get more quiet feet when I subconsciously tap my off foot up a route. I would like to become more efficient with my off foot and save my shoes a bit more. Thank you.
Marc
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Post by MarkAnderson on Apr 4, 2016 9:51:39 GMT -7
That's a great question (which I will largely ignore  ). I think it's worth considering if or when it is important to have "quiet feet". When I was a teenager there were two climbing videos we could rent from the local sporting goods store, "Moving Over Stone", and "The Art of Leading". Both classics, the latter written by and starring John Long. That video made a point that you shouldn't sketchily drag your lagging foot up the wall--instead you should lift it off the rock and then carefully place it where you want it to go. Obviously that sequence made an impression on me (since I still remember it 20+ years after viewing). The reason it made an impression is that it always puzzled me. Why is it so important to do this? Two decades later, I still don't know the answer (other than, as you mentioned, to save the rubber on your shoes). As you pointed out, the "off" foot is usually flagging in that situation. That's generally a good thing, and should be encouraged. I think "silent feet" can be a bit of an affectation. The goal is to get your foot on the hold in the correct spot, as quickly and effortlessly as possible. Whether or not that makes a sound is totally irrelevant. In some situations it costs more energy to get your foot to its destination silently. Clearly it's undesirable to expend extra energy simply to make a move look a certain way (yet people do this all the time). Anyway, to answer your question, check out the "Stutter Step" drill on page 64 of the RCTM. This drill encourages you to do three+ foot movements per hand movement, and can be a solution to your "problem" in some situations. The reason you need to flag the "off" foot is that your center of mass (COM) is out of balance with respect to your attachment points (arms and other foot). By shuffling your feet, you may be able to get your COM in balance so that the other foot can be removed casually, without flagging. Generally your "on" foot needs to end up between where it started and where your "off" foot is flagging. It may take a couple foot movements to get the foot there. This won't work all the time, because it requires many footholds that are in the correct location relative to the handholds. But it usually works outside on rock types that offer plentiful footholds (or large handholds, such that you can get by with smearing your feet). Hopefully that makes sense--it's a lot easier to explain in person. |
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Post by marcusyoya on Apr 4, 2016 10:00:07 GMT -7
Thanks Mark, I will give that a go. I feel like I only resort to that when there are no high feet for the off foot and it gives some semblance of balance as you stand up on the high foot for a long move. Does tapping your foot up for a move really impede climbing ability, or is it purely just wasting rubber and poor style? I flip flop between thinking that it is really important for efficiency and not important at all other than using up rubber. Cheers.
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Post by MarkAnderson on Apr 4, 2016 10:24:11 GMT -7
I do it often, and it's almost always because there isn't a foothold in the perfect location. I think in those cases it is merely a matter of style. My style is to send, not to look cool failing (that explains my attire as well ). |
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Post by marcusyoya on Apr 4, 2016 10:29:24 GMT -7
I am going to quote you on that one. That IS the best style.
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Post by slimshaky on Apr 4, 2016 14:05:36 GMT -7
i completely agree with mark on this one - i think people greatly overemphasize the importance of certain things in climbing, and this is one of them. i think the solution to losing rubber is to practice doing this while bumping up an area of your shoe that isn't so crucial for protecting. in general, when i am bumping my foot up i either use the very top surface of my shoe, with my toes pointed drastically downward, or i point my shoe very much to the side and use the inside of the heel and ball of the foot. this will save the important rubber.
i once climbed at indian creek for a weekend with a kid from australia. on teflon stemming corners it was like he was kicking his toes straight into the rock like crampons. it looked (and sounded) kind of gnarly, but i tell you - this kid could stem like no one i have ever seen. his method was brutally effective.
on the other hand, one of the things that i regret a bit in my climbing development was how overly deliberate i am about placing my feet. it takes too long - i need to work on being able to do it more quickly. now, don't get me wrong, there are times when taking an extra second to really get it perfect may be worth it. however, being able to place them accurately and QUICKLY is a very key skill.
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Post by jessebruni on Apr 5, 2016 8:40:06 GMT -7
So glad you guys are bringing up this point about foot tapping. I've always done it as well, and read about the whole 'Silent feet' thing for years, but largely ignored this portion of it for all the reasons Mark said. Similarly when I do a big move and need to stay in very close to the wall I'll often drag my low foot up the wall which is, by the way, absolutely horrible for the rubber, but the friction helps keep me close to the wall. Is that bad form? Maybe, but I've yet to find a solution that works better.
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Post by scojo on Apr 5, 2016 9:51:29 GMT -7
I do the same thing. In this move, the dragging foot prevents you from barndooring off the wall (usually slab). I have no idea how you could do these moves without dragging a foot.
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Post by Lundy on Apr 5, 2016 11:43:34 GMT -7
I agree with everything that has been said. The one bit of perspective I'll add, though, is that I think using an idea like silent feet is a good approach to getting beginners to focus on their foot placements, rather than knocking them all over the place without looking at them and eventually finding the hold. I'd say once someone has a modicum of decent footwork, though, this is no longer a viable approach to using your feet. I also wonder if it should be considered just a drill, and not how you're actually supposed to try to climb.
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Post by MarkAnderson on Apr 5, 2016 13:49:58 GMT -7
...it should be considered just a drill, and not how you're actually supposed to try to climb. That's a good point. I think it can be a useful drill. Similarly, the tennis ball drill can be good too, but nobody would recommend climbing that way on a hard project |
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Post by daustin on Apr 5, 2016 14:40:38 GMT -7
Agreed with everyone that tapping your foot up behind you is the way to go IMO it's useful for flagging as others have mentioned, but also it's a great way to turn your flagging foot into a smear that can help with reach when you're powering out. Sometimes just that extra iota of pressure from tapping that foot up a little higher and smearing it on the wall is the difference between latching the next hold or not... |
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Post by amalec on Apr 8, 2016 9:44:15 GMT -7
"Quiet feet" is a useful cue for climbers who hunt and peck around, mosh the whole forefoot down on megafeet in the gym, and otherwise do things that just don't translate to outdoor/harder climbing. Like other cues, it isn't a universal rule, and it doesn't work as a cue for some people.
I'd guess the key issue is assessing if dragging your feet is a deliberate approach to continuously flag vs a crutch instead of deliberative placing of the feet. And even if it's a deliberate approach, is it alway the right one, and are there other strategies that might work and should be practiced?
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Post by slimshaky on Apr 8, 2016 9:56:18 GMT -7
one sort of ironic thing about foot dragging - there have definitely been routes where i accidently discovered a key toe hook dragging my foot.
but, as others have said - the silent feet drill is a good one to get folks consistent at watching their fool the ENTIRE way to the hole, instead of looking away at the last second.
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Post by Elvis K on Apr 25, 2016 5:31:52 GMT -7
I coach the climbing team at my gym, so when I feel that their foot work needs improvement they will do these 2 drills.
1) During warmup, they have a long traverse that they do but only using the smallest feet. We have a lot of small foot jibs. It then becomes their normal warmup.
2) I also put up 2 jugs on a 35 and put a ton of jibs and make them move their feet only, sometimes matching or stepping through. Once they look like they are improving, they can only use the farthest feet away from them. I have seen some really good improvements from this one.
Hope this helps.
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). I think it's worth considering if or when it is important to have "quiet feet". When I was a teenager there were two climbing videos we could rent from the local sporting goods store, "Moving Over Stone", and "The Art of Leading". Both classics, the latter written by and starring John Long. That video made a point that you shouldn't sketchily drag your lagging foot up the wall--instead you should lift it off the rock and then carefully place it where you want it to go. Obviously that sequence made an impression on me (since I still remember it 20+ years after viewing). 
