Wall now complete (photos attached)

[firebug]

I am a new climber and have neither a gym nor rock to train on within four hours of my home.  All advice I have received is that "I need to climb more."  I am building a home wall with a friend and need advice on holds.  We have hang boards and can get to the climbing gym about once a week.  The wall/board will therefore need to serve both as our ARC and (limit and linked) boulder problem center.  We have settled on a Moon Board type design but plan to make the wall incline moveable.  We are both currently climbing at V3, but seem to be moving up a grade every few weeks (as I mentioned we have only been at it for a few months).  I understand that most Moon Board problems start at V6.  That, our newbieness and the need to ARC train on it makes me think that Moon holds are probably not the best choice to start off with. We will place our T nuts in the Moon Board pattern so that will be available to us later on when our skill level warrants it.  


My question is which set of holds does the community recommend for our board size and level?  My thought is that I only want bolt on holds so as to not damage the wall.  Should I not concern myself with that?  Researching on posts on this site, here are the holds were are considring:


1.  it seems Mark Anderson really likes E Grips.    The Classic Home Gym kit seems like a nice starter set:  e-grips.com/p-351-egrips-classic-home-gym-kit.aspx

2.  3 Ball Climbing offers this package.  www.threeballclimbing.com/climbing_holds/basic_climbing_holds.htm  

3. Metolius Mega Pack.  www.metoliusclimbing.com/mega_packs.html  Is a "name brand", but appears that many of the holds in the set are screw on. 

4. Moon Holds School Set B.  www.moonclimbing.com/gear/climbing-holds/school-holds-train-full-set-b.html  Perhaps get the school set B and combine it with one of the other sets I listed above to allow us more ARCing opportunities while still being able to access the Moon problems.  

We do have some experienced route setters that we will be able to call upon to set up our initial routes and create new ones as we progress through or become board with the existing ones.  

I am asking for the hold advice now as we live in Costa Rica and need to source the holds from outside of the country.  I´m heading to the US this month and it´s my chance to pick up the holds and bring them back with me.  Everything else we can source here in CR.  

All advice appreciated.  I will definitely post plans of the final design and photos of the buildout.  Thanks for the help!

JR

Attachments:

[tedwelser]

Apr 15, 2017 9:00:00 GMT -7 firebug said:

I am a new climber and have neither a gym nor rock to train on within four hours of my home.  All advice I have received is that "I need to climb more."  I am building a home wall with a friend and need advice on holds.  We have hang boards and can get to the climbing gym about once a week.  The wall/board will therefore need to serve both as our ARC and (limit and linked) boulder problem center.  We have settled on a Moon Board type design but plan to make the wall incline moveable.  We are both currently climbing at V3, but seem to be moving up a grade every few weeks (as I mentioned we have only been at it for a few months).  I understand that most Moon Board problems start at V6.  That, our newbieness and the need to ARC train on it makes me think that Moon holds are probably not the best choice to start off with. We will place our T nuts in the Moon Board pattern so that will be available to us later on when our skill level warrants it.  


My question is which set of holds does the community recommend for our board size and level?  My thought is that I only want bolt on holds so as to not damage the wall.  Should I not concern myself with that?  Researching on posts on this site, here are the holds were are considring:


1.  it seems Mark Anderson really likes E Grips.    The Classic Home Gym kit seems like a nice starter set:  e-grips.com/p-351-egrips-classic-home-gym-kit.aspx

2.  3 Ball Climbing offers this package.  www.threeballclimbing.com/climbing_holds/basic_climbing_holds.htm  

3. Metolius Mega Pack.  www.metoliusclimbing.com/mega_packs.html  Is a "name brand", but appears that many of the holds in the set are screw on. 

4. Moon Holds School Set B.  www.moonclimbing.com/gear/climbing-holds/school-holds-train-full-set-b.html  Perhaps get the school set B and combine it with one of the other sets I listed above to allow us more ARCing opportunities while still being able to access the Moon problems.  

We do have some experienced route setters that we will be able to call upon to set up our initial routes and create new ones as we progress through or become board with the existing ones.  

I am asking for the hold advice now as we live in Costa Rica and need to source the holds from outside of the country.  I´m heading to the US this month and it´s my chance to pick up the holds and bring them back with me.  Everything else we can source here in CR.  

All advice appreciated.  I will definitely post plans of the final design and photos of the buildout.  Thanks for the help!

JR

[


Hey JR- You should check out the design of the moon Kilter hybrid wall that I put together last year. We have moon board plus a 20 degree wall and overhanging arête on Both sides of the moon board. The hybrid wall has an extra grid of tnuts. [check out climb Athens on FB and see a current photo and a recent video; also the bouldering in Athens county log has details on the Kilter holds we have on our hybrid wall] .

[firebug]

Thanks for the reply Ted. I found your post on Bouldering Athens County blog spot. Very helpful for the number of holds and also how/where you added T-nuts. I believe I read one of your past post that gave me the idea for combining the Moon holds with some more positive grips. I´ll check out Kilter´s site. Need to make a decision in the next couple days.

JR

[Otis.]

Hey JR,

Kilter definitely makes some of the best holds on the market. Their puffy edges in the Noah and Winter lines are great for ARCing. They also have several excellent crimp sets, I would highly recommend Noah Small 1 and Small 5 and Winter small 2 and 3. Noah small 5 on a moon board will probably be harder than what you can currently climb, but the others are great for V3-6 routes on a 30.

You can also email Kilter directly and ask them for advice. Their sales team all serve as head setters/owners at various gyms, so they get a lot of feedback on their shapes and can provide some great suggestions on which holds to get.

Outside of Kilter, Teknik, eGrips, Kingdom, Flathold and Enix all make great holds that are generally ergonomically friendly across their line. SoIll and Element also have some great shapes, but also a higher rate of duds.

[willblack]

JR,

I agree that you are doing the right thing by supplementing extra holds on your moonboard, but its worth noting that there are lots of moonboard problems that are much easier than V6. The lowest grade that can be assigned to a problem is 6b+(V4), but there are several problems that are probably V3 and lots of good V4's.

e-Grips is an awesome company, but I would recommend going to a mega gym and climbing on some of their holds and buying them set by set based on what you like rather than just buying a somewhat random assortment.

Most of Metolius's classic holds are garbage, but their new polyurethane sets are worth checking out.

I wouldn't worry about ruining your wall with a few screw on holds, that would take years and years of frequent resets

I second Ted's point about the Moon/Kilter hybrid, I have a similar setup at my house though I would personally recommend against Kilter's Teagan line. I just find them awkward to hold on to and very different from most outdoor holds Everything else they make is awesome though

ARCing: I climb V7/5.12+ and I don't think I could truly ARC on my 40 degree wall unless I used holds so large they would destroy my skin and not be very specific to actual climbing. I recommend a less steep angle if you want to ARC

General thoughts on a 40 degree wall/Moonboard for beginners: the moonboard is an awesome tool, but like other training tools it shouldn't be used by itself. The campus board is also a great tool, but if it was the only training tool you ever used you probably wouldn't be a very well-rounded climber. Make sure you seek out opportunities to climb on routes outside your style, and climb on angles less steep than the moonboard whenever possible. Also, don't get in the habit of full crimping every single hold and rest more than you think you need to. I always need two days of rest after moonboarding. Getting injured and getting set back several months is never worth it. All that being said, I'm sure you will have a great time and get a lot stronger on your new wall.

[ksenger08]

Hey JR, 

I would recommend looking at Atomik and Teknik holds, both brands offer a wide variety at a reasonable price. I personally think Atomik is the best for the Buck. I recently finished building my home wall which has a mix of multiple angles (slab, 6, 15, 30, 45, moon wall, and huge roof section). I have found that the moonboard is good but overall I don't use it as much as the other walls. Wanted to post some pics but can't. 

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Anyone know how to post PICS without URL? 

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[firebug]

Thank you everyone for your comments. I had narrowed down my choice to eGrips, until I logged on and checked this blog and found repeated Kilter plugs. There holds do look great. I´ve emailed them (thanks for the tip Otis) and asked for some help putting together a set of 100 to 110 grips. The eGrips set, with stainless hardware, will cost me about $700 for 110 grips. I traded out to feature grips form their Classic Home Gym set and will substitute them for an extra set of pockets or crimps. With such a small wall, from the advice i received, I would be better off with more holds than a couple large features.

Will, thanks for the advice on the board. I plan to make the angle variable if I can do so without compromising the stability of the board. Honestly 40 degrees currently kicks my butt. It´s one of the reasons I need a board - to spend more time on a wall. I´ll see what Kilter comes back with. I did notice that Ian Powell has shaped for both Kilter and eGrips. They both look awesome to me.

Ksenger08 I would love to see photos of your wall. Does your wall have 5 sections or is the incline adjustable? I would love to see the mechanism if it is adjustable. Here´s my email if you can´t figure out how to post pics: [e-mail].

JR

[climbnkev]

So I know both Kilter and E grips make some of the best home wall holds on earth, but the biggest challenge with building a home wall is setting quality problems. You can get 160 moon holds (all three sets) for $670 including shipping to the states. While they are not as good of holds you also get 5,000 Boulder problems and counting. If your wall is adjustable you should be able to scale the problems to your level by changing the angle of your wall.

Just another idea to think about.

[Otis.]

Apr 17, 2017 20:53:21 GMT -7 firebug said:

 I did notice that Ian Powell has shaped for both Kilter and eGrips. They both look awesome to me.

JR

Ian was one of the original owner/founders of eGrips, before venturing off and later starting Kilter.  Climbing Magazine or some other climbing related media did a story on Ian a few year's ago.  It was worth the read, if you are a hold geek like I am.  In my opinion, he is probably the best hold shaper out there.  Most of the eGrips classic shapes were originally shaped by Ian.  He does a great job marrying form and function.  

My personal three favorite shapers would be Ian, followed by Louie Anderson (SoIll, Kingdom, Element, and a few others), and Seth and Zoe Johnston (Teknik).  There are a lot of other great shapers out there, but I think these three consistently produce great shapes and rarely produce a bad set.      

 

[Otis.]

I would also add/second an earlier comment to fill your wall with mostly small to medium sized holds. Feature holds can be fun in the gym, but take up too much real estate on a home wall.

[firebug]

Again, thank you everyone for the feedback. I wound up going with eGrips. Here is my opening lineup:

1. Bubble Wrap Ledges 5
2. Jibber Jabber Jugs 3
3. Drop Art Finger Buckets 10
4. Granite Ledges 10
5. Limestone semi-huecos 10
6. Myorcan Tufas 5
7. Buttons 20
8. Pure Line Mini Jugs 10
9. Comfy Crimps 10
10. Jax Jugs 1 5

I traded out the two features: Papa Elephant and Hueco Wonder Hole and added instead:

11. Pure Power Pockets 5

Total cost with US shipping and stainless hardware about $730. While I think the set may favor a lot of positive holds, I only hope I think that in six months time and need to increase the incline of the board or buy smaller holds. These guys won´t reach Costa Rica until the end of April so I hope to have some design plans or maybe just photos of the wall as it goes up around that time. If there are any glaring omissions, like maybe some more footholds? Please let me know.

JR

[daustin]

Hey Firebug -- I'm curious about your plans for the wall and have some questions if you don't mind. Will also be interested to see your design plans or photos of the wall as it goes up!

You mention you're in Costa Rica, and also that you're using stainless hardware. Will this be an outdoor wall? I'm guessing that it's a relatively marine climate with lots of damp, salty air? I live in the SF Bay Area in CA in an area with tons of damp, salty air, and I'm starting to think about plans for an outdoor home wall. Anything else you're doing in particular to weather proof the wall?

[MarkAnderson]

Apr 18, 2017 7:20:01 GMT -7 Otis. said:

Apr 17, 2017 20:53:21 GMT -7 firebug said:

 I did notice that Ian Powell has shaped for both Kilter and eGrips. They both look awesome to me.

JR

Ian was one of the original owner/founders of eGrips, before venturing off and later starting Kilter.  Climbing Magazine or some other climbing related media did a story on Ian a few year's ago.  It was worth the read, if you are a hold geek like I am.  In my opinion, he is probably the best hold shaper out there.  Most of the eGrips classic shapes were originally shaped by Ian.  He does a great job marrying form and function.  

...
 

Totally agree, many of my favorite sets were shaped by Ian.

[Chris W]

Rock and Ice did that article.

[climbnkev]

Hi Guys,
Sounds like there is some interest in adjustable angle outdoor woodies so I thought I would share a few pics of mine. It's 12x12 semi-freestanding ( attached to the stub wall but no penetration of the vinyl roof membrane of my garage/shop roof.)
It pivots off a central point to easily allow me to adjust from 15 to 40 degrees.






I backed the wall with scrap metal roofing I had left over from a project.



I have a gutter at the top of the kickboard that collects runoff.



After a few snowstorms I decided to add this additional shed roof to divert about 1/2 of the snow/rain and keep from having a pile-up behind the wall.




Things I would do differently:

It would be a better design if the support posts were anchored in concrete so they could be vertical and not extend out in front of the wall.  I have some padding I will be addingto them but a sideways winger could hurt.  I flashed the top of the wall but it would be better with a small roof section that kept water off the top-out jugs.  I have built a bubble that let me paint and set the wall even during a snow storm, but because the wall changes angle it's tough to get the bubble to adjust too.  I can't share my adjustable mechanism but if you google adjustable moonboard you should be able to track down similar design ideas.  Best of luck on your new wall!