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Post by Chris W on May 30, 2014 18:27:08 GMT -7
I'll soon be starting my first ever Power phase and am having a bit of trouble coming up with creative ideas for "limit boulder" problems. Do you guys have any photos/videos/examples of problems you have set in the past? I've read through the descriptions of the ideal "limit boulder" for power training, but a picture is worth a thousand words....
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Post by MarkAnderson on Jun 1, 2014 15:23:51 GMT -7
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Post by Chris W on Jun 1, 2014 17:31:42 GMT -7
Mark, I've already checked out the post, which was very well done and helpful. I actually have some of the holds you listed, which helps. I'll probably also seek inspiration from my local boulder field, which has plenty of tough "one move wonder" problems. Thanks to Mike, btw, for your response on my question regarding building a campus board. I've decided to build it in a different area so that I'll have plenty of room for lateral body movement. Should be interesting, haven't done any campus work before. I'll look forward to an example video.
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Post by MarkAnderson on Jun 1, 2014 19:08:51 GMT -7
Chris,
Here are two examples of Limit Boulder problems. Neither of these are really Limit problems for me now, but they were when these videos were shot. The first one is a crimpy V10ish problem. It's a bit on the long side with 6 moves, but only two of the moves are really hard (3rd and 5th), with the 3rd move being the hardest. You want the limiting move(s) to be fairly low so you aren't fatigued when climbing them, and so they're easy to work. Notice that most of the moves are dynamic, and the footwork is fairly intricate. All the holds except the finishing loaf are "realistic":
The next one is a V10ish pocket problem. Notice that it requires precise dynamic movement:
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Post by Chris W on Jun 2, 2014 5:18:59 GMT -7
Perfect, thank you! I had envisioned something more wildly dynamic by the descriptions in the book, but I actually have 3 problems on the 35 degree wall right now that will fit the bill nicely. I'm a horrible judge when it comes to grades, but I set the problems this fall and didn't manage to complete them by the end of the winter. Should be about the right length and level of effort involved.
I'm having a lot of fun with the book and experimenting with new types of training. Thanks so much for all the hard work you guys have done.
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Post by solwertkin on Jan 7, 2015 17:49:06 GMT -7
I'm not the only one that crushes to Iron Maiden
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Post by tedwelser on Jan 8, 2015 18:06:56 GMT -7
I love the timing of the final deadpoint on the crimp problem.
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Post by MarkAnderson on Jan 8, 2015 18:54:01 GMT -7
I love the timing of the final deadpoint on the crimp problem. Haha, that is pretty sweat. The lyrics are oddly appropriate too: I have the fire, I have the force I have the power to make my evil take its course
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Post by crossing on Jan 9, 2015 9:29:28 GMT -7
What should the approximate success rate be for sticking the crux move of a limit boulder problem? I would imagine if you are always sticking the crux move, then the problem is not right at the climbers maximum limit. On the flip side if the problem is too hard, and your not latching the crux hold at all, is the climber may not be getting all of the recruitment benefits that come with limit bouldering. I'm currently on my fourth limit bouldering day, and I have about a 50% success rate for sticking the crux move (first move) and I'm thinking of modifying the problem to make the move harder. What are your thoughts?
(Sorry for the lame music - radio)
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Post by MarkAnderson on Jan 9, 2015 9:51:23 GMT -7
Crossing,
There is a slow build-up into Limit Bouldering within the workout so that you will have many reps on moves that you have a relatively high success rate on. A move you stick 50% of the time is more in the "Hard Bouldering" range. Limit Bouldering moves should be moves you have to work for several days (or even multiple cycles in extreme cases), just to do once. It should be something to aspire to, but its also something you fail a lot at, which is why actual Limit Bouldering is only a small portion of the total workout.
Once you've done the move once, it should become easier, assuming you are learning the move better, and you are generally improving at rock climbing as a result of the training program. Ideally a problem that was initially a Limit Boulder problem will eventually become a "Hard Bouldering" problem, and then maybe even a part of your Warmup Boulder Ladder.
Anyway, yes, make it harder. Or, keep the problem, use it for Hard Bouldering, and create something new, that is slightly harder, for Limit Bouldering.
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Post by Chris W on Jun 28, 2017 16:03:21 GMT -7
OK, so I successfully completed all my limit boulder problems this spring and had to set another. 5 moves, 2 limit moves. Though I didn't plan it this way, I discovered the best way to complete limit move number 1 probably involves a drop knee. Left hand on small edge, right hand on small rounded crimp, right foot wide, left foot drop knee to push my body into the wall, left hand snatch to another crummy rounded crimp. It's not an uncomfortable move to try. Haven't stuck it yet.
What I'm wondering is whether or not it is a bad idea to have a drop knee on a limit move while TRAINING. I don't want to get injured. I could do the move without the drop knee, which would put my body off balance and my body square to the wall. Not necessarily good technique. Or I could change the feet on the problem to make it more "ergonomic". Any suggestions?
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Post by MarkAnderson on Jun 28, 2017 16:33:28 GMT -7
There is a thread on here somewhere about Drop Knee injuries where I talk about this, but I think that it's not the Drop Knee that is potential harmful, it's twisting/rotating your knee into the dropped position. I think as long as you avoid that, Drop Knees in training are fine and worth practicing, but I would avoid doing intense rotations into the dropped position. Make sense?
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Post by daustin on Jun 28, 2017 16:35:32 GMT -7
Does it feel extreme enough to pose some injury risk? Similar to heel hooks, there are some pretty mild instances where you can pretty much tell that you could do that move indefinitely and not get injured, but there are also more extreme cases where you can tell you're torquing your knee and even if you don't think you'll injure yourself in the moment, you'd think twice about doing that move repeatedly over the course of months/years. If it's obviously mild, I wouldn't worry about. It's an inherently squishy criterion though, so I'd err on the side of caution.
Knees are precious, so if it's extreme enough that you came here to ask about it, I'd probably think about changing the feet to eliminate it. Or to your point, you could do the move without the drop knee -- I wouldn't worry about that being bad technique, it's really just making a move on plastic harder based on an arbitrary limitation you're placing on yourself, which when you get down to it is kind of fundamental to climbing indoors. You can still practice good technique (drop knees, heel hooks, etc.) through other means like ARCing and hard bouldering, but I'd be wary of doing it in a limit problem when you're pushing yourself and trying the exact same movement many, many times.
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Post by Chris W on Jun 28, 2017 19:54:43 GMT -7
Yeah, I'm torn (not literally, of course). The motion and the position don't bother me in any way, and they don't feel stressful or tweaky either. Neither the hand move to the next hold nor the fall from that position seem to cause any discomfort either. The reason I wouldn't want to do the move without the drop knee is I don't want to practice the bad form. If I change things, I'll probably just set different feet on the wall.
The move itself does involve twisting the knee into the position. The problem starts with the left hip in to the wall, right toe on, left foot flagged. Then once the hands are in position, I turn to place my left toe on the hold with hips square to the wall, then drop the knee bringing the left hip and body back in.
I'll probably try to video tape it and see how it looks. So far it feels fine.
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Post by stanleybaker on Aug 28, 2017 14:17:53 GMT -7
The main question I have about LB is how do you know you can "eventually" make the move? How do you know it's just not too hard and you'll be flailing at it endlessly? I've set up two limit problems on a systems board, and so far my litmus is getting onto the holds to make sure I can hold on AFTER making the move. That still doesn't help me really know though if I can make the move, especially if it's supposed to be so hard I may not get it for multiple sessions.
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