Anybody seem to get worse while training?

[mobo13]

Has any one felt like they got worse while training? Is this just muscle fatigue? Do I need more rest days? Or should I just push through and I will see the gains towards the end of the program?

Suddenly stuff that used to be relatively easy feels strenuous. Some examples leading a 5.9 in the gym I felt so tired I had to take. Usually I can lead up to about 10d with very little effort and 11s up to about 12a depending on the type of route feel pretty challenging/tiring but doable. Also had the same thing happen a session before that where I got on an 10b and it felt like an 11b. I thought it was maybe the route setting but my partner who climbs at a significantly lower grade than me flew up the climb and loved it.

Anyways, I've played competitive sports most of my life, so I can totally push through the rest of the training if the gains will be there at the end no matter how tired I am throughout the process, but my question is will they be there at the end? Or am I actually making myself get worse at climbing or limiting my gains?

[MarkAnderson]

What’s your schedule? What days are you training? What training are you doing on those days? What days are you leading routes in the gym?

[mobo13]

During the basic fitness phase I'd arc 2*25 on Tues and Thurs or something overhung and then climb about 6-8 routes after. I'd also just climb for fun on Weds or Fridays about half the time. Then I'd sport climb or boulder outside on Saturday and Sunday. Just finished my second week of the strength phase. Hang Board Mon&Thurs will maybe 6 moderate routes (10s-low 11s) lead or top rope for warmup. Sometimes outside on Weds. Then climbing outside Saturday and Sunday. Also doing some additional strength exercises as recommended in the book on Mon & Thurs - abs and shoulder exercises. Then I also do a little bit of a leg workout and some cardio 2days a week whenever I have time.

[MarkAnderson]

Ok, you’re tired. I’d recommend less volume if you want to get the most out of your training.

[acmesalute76]

Yes, this is a crazy amount of volume. During the strength phase the main focus is HANGBOARDING. Try and remember that. The hangboard is where you are going to make gains. Anything else you do on top of that is just going to make it harder to recover, so it had better be worthwhile. Do some supplemental work, maybe sneak in some EASY climbing the day after your session, but you want to be fresh for the hangboard. Yes, you will have to climb less, and at a lower intensity, but it’s a short term sacrifice and you WILL experience long term gains if you stick with it. Nothing will get your fingers as strong as proper hangboarding!

For the base fitness phase, you’re probably climbing at too high an intensity as well. If you expect to survive 3-5 days a week of climbing/ARC workouts, you need to climb at a level that allows you to recover within 24 hours or so, or else you’re just digging yourself deeper each workout. If you do a little too much it’s not the end of the world, but you need to keep it light so that you can get the proper amount of volume to benefit.

A good rule of thumb while doing any kind of training is that if you feel like death all the time, especially if you feel that way during your training sessions, then you’re probably doing too much!

[mobo13]

Thanks guys! My other question is if you do nothing but hangboard during the strength phase how do not lose gains made during the base fitness phase? I've never trained for climbing, but for other sports like gymnastics and basketball if I had taken time off to just train a specific muscle group then I would have lost a lot of my other strength and endurance. Granted I'm not 16 any more so I probably cannot train every day - but if you don't climb at all during this phase how does everything but your hands not get weaker?

[jetjackson]

Everything else does technically get 'weaker' in the sense that your endurance and other elements will diminish, however the sacrifice is worth the gain that you make in strength by focusing all of your recovery capacity on making those forearms stronger. It's important to understand - the building of the strength happens when you recover from the intense Hangboard workout - hamstringing that recovery or your ability to push hard during the hangboard session, by trying to do other things, will only hamper your gains.

As the cycle is meant to time all of your physical elements to peak during the performance phase, you will regain power and endurance elements lost when you get to the performance phase. Everything is timed to peak then, so you train the aspects of your physiology based on which ones diminish the fastest.

[acmesalute76]

Jun 30, 2019 14:29:40 GMT -7 mobo13 said:

Thanks guys! My other question is if you do nothing but hangboard during the strength phase how do not lose gains made during the base fitness phase? I've never trained for climbing, but for other sports like gymnastics and basketball if I had taken time off to just train a specific muscle group then I would have lost a lot of my other strength and endurance. Granted I'm not 16 any more so I probably cannot train every day - but if you don't climb at all during this phase how does everything but your hands not get weaker?

You do climb during this phase. You can and should ARC for 20-30 minutes as a warmup for the hangboard. This will help maintain endurance and allow you to continue to practice skills. You can also climb easier stuff the day after hangboarding, although as your hangboard workouts get harder you should reduce how much of this you do. See the RCTM training plan for suggestions on how much to climb during this phase. This is a great time to work on things like friction slab which will improve your climbing and aren’t that strenuous.

Remember that climbing has a large technical aspect, and that by focusing on that you can still make gains sometimes without climbing hard!